Is this still the right format?

Post by **Eric** » Mon Mar 10, 2025 9:40 am

As I mentioned in the Fringe chat, this forum software is long overdue for an update. I'm willing to pay that cost, but before doing so I'd like to know if this is still the preferred format or should we be looking at something completely different?

I'm still working on the database crash issue.

Post by **Eric** » Mon Mar 10, 2025 11:56 am

to be clear, we're at a point where we need to either update what we have, move to something else, or shut down

Oscar · Post by **Oscar** » Mon Mar 10, 2025 4:59 pm

Honestly as much as I still enjoy this place there are many of us still active? I don’t frequent any other 4x4 boards anymore. Do they still have traffic? How do they drive traffic to them these days? Is it is it worth you efforts anymore?

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Mon Mar 10, 2025 5:57 pm

I don't know. What baffles me is the fact that there are still thousands of people who wheel in Colorado so how are they communicating these days? How are they planning trips? How are they asking for help when they need it be it broke down on a trail or just building their rig?

When everyone started leaving here, a lot claimed that they were going to Facebook but I've looked there and didn't find anything with more traffic than there is here. Maybe you have to have a secret handshake or something, i don't know.

We know that people lurk here so why don't they start posting back up? Sure, a lot have moved on from wheeling a 4x4 like myself but that doesn't mean I quit wheeling something. Ive gone from 4x4 rigs to 4-wheelers to sand rails back to 4-wheelers to side by sides and now back to 4-wheelers. I haven't lost interest in wheeling, my location just dictates a different type of rig. Now, its mostly trail riding and sand dunes.

I have no insite on what needs to happen with this board unless we can figure out where everyone went.

Post by **Eric** » Tue Mar 11, 2025 6:46 pm

I don't know what they're using either. To grow this site again is going to take someone moderating registrations. It got so bad with spammers that I had to make it a manual review process and I haven't been doing that. Also to stop the bots sucking bandwidth I had to effectively turn off the forum to guests so you have to be logged in to see any content. Both of these are killing any chance of new interest / members. This last one can be addressed by updating the software, but I'll still need help from someone to review registrations. However, only two responses in here so far seems like a hint at current levels of interest. I appreciate these two responses, but would like to hear from others? What do we want to do?

Willie G · Post by **Willie G** » Tue Mar 11, 2025 7:12 pm

I have a hard time understanding how it is economically feasible to run this board for the 5-10 people who still use it. I am too uninformed to make an intelligent suggestion about the way forward - upgrades/changes will cost money, which circles around to the low number of users.

That said, I want to express my appreciation and gratitude for the 22 years I have been a member and had the pleasure of everyone's company. It has been a wonderful experience.

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Tue Mar 11, 2025 7:51 pm

Eric wrote:I don't know what they're using either. To grow this site again is going to take someone moderating registrations. It got so bad with spammers that I had to make it a manual review process and I haven't been doing that. Also to stop the bots sucking bandwidth I had to effectively turn off the forum to guests so you have to be logged in to see any content. Both of these are killing any chance of new interest / members. This last one can be addressed by updating the software, but I'll still need help from someone to review registrations. However, only two responses in here so far seems like a hint at current levels of interest. I appreciate these two responses, but would like to hear from others? What do we want to do?

I would think that the board could be grown again but I don't know how to go about that. What kind of other platforms are available to go to if you went that direction? As far as vetting registrations go, I'm pretty sure that Steve doesn't have a job.

Kidding aside, I would be willing to help but my computer skills are somewhat limited due to that fact that I am old.

Whatever the decision is, like Willie and Rex have both stated, we appreciate so much what this board has provided for all of these years.

Rex Ashton · Post by **Rex Ashton** » Wed Mar 12, 2025 10:33 am

Yeah Eric, ditto with Allen and Willie G ....

1) We are all extremely thankful for all you've done over the years. However, given the reduced audience, we understand it's tough to justify the fruitless work you've had to do recently to keep us afloat here.... Extremely appreciative.

2) We had some curiosity on what another option might look like, not that it would need to be another exercise for you to take on.

3) It's beyond cool that you expressed you would take on the cost for the needed software upgrade to keep us running as-is. Again, not sure what another format would look like, nor your cost profile either direction.

I'll throw out my personal (partially selfish) thoughts....

I've made a lot of friends on this board. I remember Clifton Slay telling me to join, which I did in the original 100 members before that major crash that wiped us all out.... Re-joined later with a much heavier member number, lol. If I tried to count the friends, business contacts, real estate transactions, etc. from here, I'd definitely forget and leave someone out. To single out one I met here would be Curt, aka Pioneer where we've helped him relocate twice, helped his father flip houses, his daughter find a home, I finished her basement later on, and have 10 real estate transactions within the family. He called me this morning to let me know his father passed on Monday and we're trying to help him navigate things.

There have been many other connections made, and most of us know how to find each other beyond this site. When it goes down, my wife Jodi hears me complain that CO4x4 might be gone now and it's the end of an era. She's not a member, but has made many connections here as well. Then, as always, you somehow revive the site.

There is a small group of us (you've probably figured out) who are always happy when you initiate the life support, as we've always wanted it to remain. That is still the case, but I think we've come to terms with it going away.

Here's the selfish part and IMO the largest negative of shutting it down ----- Beyond the minimal current traffic, I like the 22 years of history I've had and the reference material that exists. Sometimes I search for something here in the past and I land in a wormhole where I start reading through classic threads with members I forgot were here..... Makes me laugh and sparks up memories.

Again, could not blame you for just shutting it down and the history will be missed.... Don't want you to incur unnecessary costs, but I'll be happy if it somehow survives. Either way, thanks for the years Eric.

Post by **Eric** » Wed Mar 12, 2025 3:30 pm

Thanks for the feedback Rex! It has always been my pleasure to keep this site going as long as it provided value. I should have handed it off long ago though as my own interests shifted resulting in significant neglect as an admin. I'm sorry for that.

For other options I was thinking one of the social network sites so nobody has to deal with software updates and it just works. I know there's a Colorado4x4.org facebook group, that I'm actually not a member of, but that's just an example.

Dug up this old post, I think it's relevant. We're over 24 years now! http://www.colorado4x4.org/vbb/showthre ... 7-15-years!

I know there are many many memories stored in this database, including some from people we've lost over the years. If we shut it down I'd save an archive file of the whole thing but not sure what I'd do with it. Wouldn't feel right to just let it all evaporate to the internet ether.

Post by **Eric** » Wed Mar 12, 2025 3:36 pm

BTW still have the same Jeep, still haven't fixed my D300 transfer case so it still has the "temporary" D20 in it, still in the same house and it still isn't finished

Kids have gotten much bigger since that 15 year post though!

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Wed Mar 12, 2025 4:33 pm

I just looked at the colorado4x4.org facebook thing and its had zero posts today. I started to join just so I could see how long its been since there was a post on it but didn't. This is again what is baffling to me. I can't believe that the entire off road community just decided that they don't want to have a place to shoot the shat with other like minded people or have a way to plan trips or get togethers or anything.

Rex Ashton · Post by **Rex Ashton** » Thu Mar 13, 2025 9:07 am

Eric ---

1) That 15 yr anny thread was very cool and very relevant! Thanks for the reminder

2) Pretty cool you still have the same Jeep. Get that D300 back in there man, lol ..... I went from my YJ that a lot of people here knew to a 2-seater buggy w/ rear-steer to getting out of the sport after kids. I sold both of those rigs (not on CL; not on Pirate) but on this site!

3) I don't think our houses are ever finished. I'm also in the same one for about 20 years now with most of my 4-page punch-list from move-in-day still pending, lulz .... The kids getting older thing is a never-ending fluid crisis requiring 24-hr/day management. The oldest son (20) has a son his own 18mo son. Too many people in my house, but the little guy is getting more fun every day. Youngest son is a highly regarded basketball player about to enter high school, and the choice of school / basketball program was important, so his freshman year will be pretty taxing with a twice/day commute for Jodi or I ... Sophomore year, he can deal with it

4) To Allen's point on FB .... I've never created a FB account, nor Insta, no TikTok on my phone currently. I have used the wife's FB for Marketplace. I'd do whatever is needed though. I'm sure to archive the history here and place it somewhere is it's own task and it's cool that you also value the history. I go back to your original question and requesting feedback "is this still the right format" and I'm just curious if the "as-is" upgrade is feasible, affordable, or worthwhile?

Again, no matter the decision, the remaining traffic here appreciates you.

Big Dave · Post by **Big Dave** » Thu Mar 13, 2025 5:19 pm

FWIW, the guy who handles all the backend stuff for me with MallCrawlin tried to move it to a new server and the old software (similar vintage vBulletin as CO4x4) would not run on the new server. Can't remember exactly why. We've purchased the updated vBulletin that will run, but have not had time to actually do anything with it so I can't comment on the current vBulletin software.

I don't hang out in the Fringe, but as others have mentioned, this place will be always be special for me. So many friends, and a marriage that's coming up on 20 years, all from here.

Rex, give Curt my best when you talk to him next. I've long lost his number, but him and his family are great people and I'm sorry to hear of his father's passing.

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Thu Mar 13, 2025 5:52 pm

Big Dave wrote: I don't hang out in the Fringe...

Ya know....other threads can be made.

Good to hear from you Dave. Glad things are going well for you.

Also, this just proves that people do lurk so there is at least some kind of interest.

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Thu Mar 13, 2025 6:00 pm

Also, while just going over to crapitalk which I despise using just now so I could post a picture on the other thread made me think about all the times back in the hayday of the board that people couldn't figure out how to post a picture here. I wonder if the relative ease of posting pictures on places like Facebook is a major player in them moving on. Just a thought...

Rex Ashton · Post by **Rex Ashton** » Fri Mar 14, 2025 8:24 am

Big Dave wrote:.....
I don't hang out in the Fringe, but as others have mentioned, this place will be always be special for me. So many friends, and a marriage that's coming up on 20 years, all from here.

Rex, give Curt my best when you talk to him next. I've long lost his number, but him and his family are great people and I'm sorry to hear of his father's passing.

Good to have you chime in Dave! If your number didn't change, you're still in my phone. I'll definitely share your best with Curt and you're right as my family has had a long relationship with his family. ... Good People... Would not have happened without CO4X4. I have a friend in Oklahoma because of it... Another in Parker along with many others. .. Did about 10 vehicle transactions with Morgan (aka The Yetti) mostly with Dodge Cummins trucks, lol.

I can reflect back with you at M&G's and your Wells Fargo days, flipping a house in your 'hood, etc. Allen had a good point relative to history of community here ... You don't have to "hang out" in the Fringe, but feel free to chime in .... it's definitely different than how it started .... Now it's just where some of the remaining die-hard members simply bullshit and all are welcome.

If the site remains, Hope to see ya re-appear and thanks for your thoughts towards Curt

Rex Ashton · Post by **Rex Ashton** » Fri Mar 14, 2025 9:01 am

Crap man, funny stories surfacing in my brain.....

Morgan (Yetti) and I would scan and notify each other on Cummins trucks hitting CL. I once brought my own cash to a truck he wanted in my part of town and I bought it. Of course, he brought me the cash and got it from my house.

I found a '98 Cummins holy grail truck at a random dealership in Boulder (trade-in at maybe Nissan??) posted on a Saturday morning. I called him as I got there and he just happened to be 3 mins away and showed up. If I didn't buy it, he would. I bought it.

I got bored with it later and Morgan bought it from me. He got bored with it and sold it back to me. My dad wanted it, so I sold it to him. My dad wanted something newer, so Morgan bought it back from my dad. Let that all sink in for a minute

There was another 2WD Cummins truck he bought, and I bought from him, then he bought it back, lol.

You can't make this shit up... only happened 'cuz CO4x4, lulz.

Rex Ashton · Post by **Rex Ashton** » Sun Mar 16, 2025 11:05 am

Big Dave.... Curt (Pioneer) called me yesterday and I passed along your best ... Are you still in the banking world?? ... He asked... I can re-connect you guys.

Sounds like we will be helping him sell his Dad's place.

'Nother funny Curt story ... I bought an F350 to flip. He called me and asked if I had something cool to sell and he bought it; not sure where it went. I had a silver Audi S4; He called me and asked if I had something cool to sell and he bought it. He got into an accident on the highway and it was totaled. He called me and asked if I had something cool to sell and bought my 2nd silver Audi S4.

One time I bought a silver '01 Cummins truck in California. Curt had time on his hands and a bunch of frequent flyer miles and went out there and drove it back. It didn't leak oil when I bought it, but dripped a little when he was done driving 90mph across a few states. I paid for a ticket he got in Utah for the tinted windows, lol. ---- Good guy; good family.

You can't make this shit up, cuz CO 4x4, lulz.

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Sun Mar 16, 2025 12:24 pm

If yall saw all of the crazy zero visibility dust storm wrecks on I-27 between Amarillo and Lubbock from Fridee, i just found out that not a close friend but a guy i knew back then was killed in that mess.

Big Dave · Post by **Big Dave** » Sun Mar 16, 2025 12:33 pm

Rex Ashton wrote:Big Dave.... Curt (Pioneer) called me yesterday and I passed along your best ... Are you still in the banking world?? ... He asked... I can re-connect you guys.

Got out of banking a couple years ago actually, still in financial services but now handling SEC compliance for smaller independent financial advisers. I also can work anywhere I have an internet connection, which has come in handy building our place in South Park.

Also, it turns out I do actually have Curt's #. I figured I had it stored under Pioneer as I used to store everyone's number in my phone by their board name, actually had him under his real name and hadn't even thought to check for that!

My number is still the same it's always been, circa 1998 or so.

Rex Ashton · Post by **Rex Ashton** » Sun Mar 16, 2025 4:03 pm

creepycrawler wrote:If yall saw all of the crazy zero visibility dust storm wrecks on I-27 between Amarillo and Lubbock from Fridee, i just found out that not a close friend but a guy i knew back then was killed in that mess.

Bummer and sorry to hear

Rex Ashton · Post by **Rex Ashton** » Sun Mar 16, 2025 4:05 pm

Big Dave wrote:I also can work anywhere I have an internet connection, which has come in handy building our place in South Park.

Try not to kill Kenny and tell Cartman I said hey

Post by **Eric** » Tue Mar 18, 2025 9:11 am

Rex Ashton wrote:I go back to your original question and requesting feedback "is this still the right format" and I'm just curious if the "as-is" upgrade is feasible, affordable, or worthwhile?

The cost to update this vbulletin software to the latest version isn't insignificant, but I'm willing to do it. However reviews on it have been pretty mixed since version 5 and version 6 is similar. So I'm not sure that's the right path. Another option is to convert to PHPBB which is free and will get us back up to date security-wise with a fairly familiar interface. I'm leaning towards that at the moment. Then turning board viewing for guests back on should help breathe new life into it.

Big Dave · Post by **Big Dave** » Tue Mar 18, 2025 3:24 pm

I logged in to JeepForum the other day for shits and giggles, was quite surprised at how much activity they had going on, the first page of new posts in the ZJ sub-forum were all within the last week. I think there may be an opportunity to recapture some of what was lost to Facebook as people try to move away from the political drama that is overrunning everything there.

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Tue Mar 18, 2025 6:15 pm

Eric wrote:The cost to update this vbulletin software to the latest version isn't insignificant, but I'm willing to do it. However reviews on it have been pretty mixed since version 5 and version 6 is similar. So I'm not sure that's the right path. Another option is to convert to PHPBB which is free and will get us back up to date security-wise with a fairly familiar interface. I'm leaning towards that at the moment. Then turning board viewing for guests back on should help breathe new life into it.

Would it be easier to post pictures on that platform? Like I mentioned above, i wonder if having to go to Tapatalk or whatever to post pics here vs faceplant may have been one reason that people jumped over there. I don't know if people posted more pics there since i never joined it but as stated, there were always people asking how to post pics here so it may have been a determining factor.

Post by **Eric** » Wed Mar 19, 2025 6:14 pm

creepycrawler wrote:Would it be easier to post pictures on that platform?

I believe so. PHPBB supports drag / drop an image into your post. I haven't tried it personally though. They have a demo on their site that I intend to check out before fully committing.

creepycrawler · Post by **creepycrawler** » Wed Mar 19, 2025 7:57 pm

Eric wrote:I believe so. PHPBB supports drag / drop an image into your post. I haven't tried it personally though. They have a demo on their site that I intend to check out before fully committing.

I think that would be helpful to bring people back but who knows.